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Public Money for Social Enterprises

Hosted by Rod Schwartz (July 2010)

public money

Should Tax Incentives for Social Enterprise Stop?
 
I recently attended the launch of a report by the Centre for the Study of Financial Innovation entitled “Investing in Social Enterprise; The Role of Tax Incentives”. What followed was one of the most vigorous and lively debates in which I have ever participated in this sector. 
 
The report catalogued the considerable number of tax incentives available for investors in social enterprise in the UK—many of which have been available for some time. Government officials in many countries are studying case studies like the UK and toying with alternatives. At the CSFI debate, numerous practitioners argued for a series of sensible refinements. Others noted that the field of play should at least be level with the private sector. There is, however, a compelling case for an end to all incentives.
 
First, there is little evidence they succeed. In the UK it seems the progress of the sector has happened despite, and not because, of the incentives. Areas of particular benefit seem to have enjoyed less, rather than more, growth.
 
Second, the vast array of incentives is highly complex, difficult and expensive to negotiate. Small wonder the cover of the report was an image of a maze.
 
Third, they are highly distortive. There is considerable evidence they also displace important private sector efforts in the social enterprise area. When these incentives are augmented by the creation of Government funded or backed vehicles, as in the UK or Ontario, Canada, for example (thus far the US has been relatively light on such distortions), this can seriously impede private sector involvement.
 
Fourth, Government incentives can be highly volatile and vulnerable to a shift in the political winds. Thus, well-intended initiatives can be undone at the stroke of a pen, which is disruptive and damaging to the operations impacted.
 
Fifth and most importantly, at such times, it is difficult to argue that our sector is as deserving as so many whose lives have been destroyed by such man-made calamities as the credit crisis and the resultant fiscal retrenchment, or the recent oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico. Our genuine concern for the social impact of our sector needs to take into account the human suffering around us.
 
Moreover, with private capital making its way into the social or impact investment space, are we really in a position to justify our pleas?
 
Nevertheless, questions remain:
 
·      Are there specific areas where there is simply no choice but to require governmental capital or fiscal incentives to correct a genuine market failure (rather than frustration over speed)?
·      Which sorts of governmental activity can have the biggest impact? In which circumstances?
·      Are any particular countries especially effective in social enterprise development as a result of governmental action? Many of my examples reflect my own Anglo-Saxon orientation. Are there other models that are working? Do recent fiscal programmes in France offer a new path to follow?
 
Join Rod Schwartz, CEO of ClearlySo, in the conversation.
 

 

Adding to rather than subtracting from

Posted by Jeff Mowatt at Jul 14, 2010 02:22 AM
Rod, The case for not being shielded in any way from taxation is something we make clearly. That as I see it is the entire point of social enterprise, that it contributes to the economy in a conventional way yet adds more to common wealth through its actions.

http://www.p-ced.com/1/about/

OTOH the approach we've been taking is one of leveraging public money for social investment, albeit not in our own business but full cost recovery social investment like CDFIs.

I have argued that there's a case for tax incentives which encourage private investment in social innovation and you've surprised me in revealing there are such things in the UK.

Very recently I'd discovered that there is local funding available through EC initiatives which offer match funding for community led initiatives which invest in "Intelligent Economic Growth". Yet at the same time there's a public outcry over council officials taking council tax funds by stealth for a healthcare SET which had been refused by the SEIF and never traded.

Now about that SEIF. A fund allocated to nonprofit social enterprise in primary care, therefore not applicable to supply chain SEs like ourselves or CICs.

We now learn that our Doh wants to make social enterprises of our hospitals, but what kind of social enterprise? My case against it being that outsourcing the health service is an inversion of social purpose.

http://www.socialenterprise[…]enterprise-sector-the-world

We might learn a good lesson from BP whose outsourcing and cost cutting ideology was reflected in 760 safety violations before the Gulf disaster.

This conversation also brings me to think about social impact bonds. If the case being made is that reducing the cost associated with a social problem like criminal re-offending, then where does the return to investors come from other than the public purse? It does however have the potential to mobilise social investment which government would otherwise need to be persuaded to make.

Talking of justifying funding pleas, one was being made yesterday to the commons by a delegation of charities. They say child rights - psrticularly the need for family, is key to achieving the MDGs by 2015. The case for social investment in this area was made to both the US and Ukrainian governments. Investment on our part was to develop the strategy plan and on theirs, increasing the adoption allowances and implementing a trial 'family homes for all' initiative. Domestic adoption has since increased by 40% albeit still on a very small number of those in need.



         
  

               

Adding to rather than subtracting from

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Jul 16, 2010 04:47 AM
Dear Jeff

Thanks as ever for your thorough and information filled reply
I think this issue will run and run as public purse strings tighten
I am intrigued by your comment on the EU, which I was not aware was providing such incentives--although I have no idea what "intelligent growth" actually refers to

Thanks again, rod

Adding to rather than subtracting from

Posted by Jeff Mowatt at Jul 17, 2010 06:37 AM
Rodm This expression 'Intelligent Economic Growth' is what loclas government us to describe the type of endeavour they'd like to support. It's to be found in the like below, where there's a 'Quick Guide to Local Action' pdf which offers some illustrations.

http://www.forestofdeanpart[…]fm?a_id=6786&tt=graphic

What to me was astonishing, was to learn there that up to 80% match funding could be secured for a community development initiative adopting a social enterprise model.

Jeff
       

Adding to rather than subtracting from

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:16 AM
Sorry Jeff (and all the rest of you who have been waiting)
I have been away

Not sure LAs can define what we all should mean by "intelligent growth"
anyway, thanks for the comment!!
80%........hmmmmmmm

regards, rod

Amen Brother!

Posted by Todd Hannula at Jul 14, 2010 03:44 AM
Complicated government intervention does not help social enterprise. I only have 5 years experience in this arena, but we have found that the most effective government intervention is simple investment. The government struggles to even get this right; often making a mockery of the word investment.

A better approach would be on changing the culture of asset lock. This is one of the fundamental problems when attempting to attract private investment; even venture philanthropic investment.

Todd
www.socialcatalyst.co.uk

Amen Brother!

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Jul 16, 2010 04:55 AM
Dear Todd

Thanks for your comment
I didn't know we were related :-)

You are right about simple investment being far preferable
It is transparent and straightforward
But simple things rarely form part of Government policy (this or the previous one)

The asset lock, which applies to community interest companies, stems from a very good idea
That the lock can be circumvented, as we pointed out in our ClearlySo (www.clearlyso.com) social business blog on the ECT Group, calls its value into question
Having said that, I do understand its intention

Take care, rod

targeted tax breaks

Posted by jo davidson at Jul 17, 2010 01:00 AM

Hey Rod, a way to look at public money for social enterprises, is through the lens of public money for free enterprises ( ie. the gamed crash of 08, in which free enterprise had been behaving 'like an 11 year old driving a motorcycle' it's only fair social enterprises get a shot at similar assistance, or with targeted tax breaks.

In toying with alternatives as purse strings tighten, investing in profit for social business (like P-CED) is a great idea to keep ecosystems chugging away, and for intelligent growth. Where there is no choice but to require gov't capital, (eg, like for past free enterprises, in that it was correcting market failures) the sort of gov't activity that can have the biggest impact is, in investing in and connecting to networks, across barriers etc, and in spreading the love with tax breaks (for profit to be reinvested back into the community, for social impact bonds) like songs - that release oxytocin for social bonding - gov't could have the biggest megaphone for that.

Hey Jeff speaking of learning lessons from BP in making the case for social investment, you know instead of letting the environment be protected for people who want to pillage it, a shift in thinking from gov't that petroleum does more harm than good, is the way to invest in alternatives. Plus in the long run it's cheaper, with driving policies / legal /tax etc, towards social innovation.

targeted tax breaks

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Jul 17, 2010 05:45 AM
Dear Jo

Thanks as ever for your comment

Your argument is hard to refute
Given the sums wasted in rescuing so many firms that caused so much harm it seems churlish not to give the #socent sector at least the chance to do the same
Heaven know far more good and much less harm would come of it
But two wrongs don't make a right (or at least that is what i was taught as a kid!), even if the second is much smaller
Also, you and I both share an interest in the sector's long term sustainability and this requires freeing ourselves of the Governmental drip

all the best, rod

freeing ourselves

Posted by jo davidson at Jul 18, 2010 02:17 AM

You're right Rod, what's needed is not government assistance but a social revolution in community capacity building. I agree that incentives are a distorted way to get there, and yeah 2 wrongs don't make a right, but 3 lefts do, in the same way 2 rights don't make a wrong they make an airplane.

I agree too, the market doesn't wait for politics to catch up, but it reveals a stark lesson when people put their own financial interests ahead of investors' and others or when business models are built on cutting corners etc.

With gov't help in unleashing the creative power of the marketplace, a fundamental transformation can take place (like a higher tax on unhealthy foods laden with fats and sugars) what it takes is a public sector response to transformative changes already happening in the private sector. It's true, commercial forces can be a source of social progress, because ultimately social progress always depends on economic empowerment. Although I do think it's time for the good ship free enterprise to walk the plank.

The real development (in the social revolution) is bridging the gap between rich and poor, and because of this in the end, self-sufficiency is the only way to free ourselves...

...that and with the help of, the divine nature of love.

freeing ourselves

Posted by Jeff Mowatt at Jul 20, 2010 01:35 AM
Unfortunately Jo, we've just got the government behind us. I say unfortunately because it is so far based on rhetoric and incomplete understanding.

We're now hearing that our hospitals will become social enterprises but on closer inspection, not SE as we know it.

On Thursday I'll be attending a local government meeting where questions are to be raised about public funding for a healthcare social enterprise, where local people had been kept out of the picture.

      

freeing ourselves

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:22 AM
Dear jeff

Local meetings without locals are pointless and just plain loco

Raise hell when you get there

rod

freeing ourselves

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:21 AM
Hey Jo

Thanks for that comment
Absolutely love your first paragraph--I have heard the "two rights" one before, but the three lefts is new to me

Business models built on cutting corners never work, there are only four corners to cut--then what?
Not sure I like your idea of a tax on unhealthy foods, as a ravenous consumer of both fats and sugars, but i get your idea
...and yes, only being self-sufficient can set us free

best, rod

the UK sector adding to the commonwealth

Posted by jo davidson at Jul 21, 2010 03:13 AM

On questions raised about public funding, I like PM David Cameron's rhetoric on the 'big society' plan, in working in partnership with local communities as 'a big advance for people power.' Time will tell if it's connected to reality, but if it leads to an exciting future for individuals and communities, giving them more control over their destinies (through redistributing power and fostering a culture of giving by aligning to shared objectives (with a different kind of agenda to cuts) then that's good.
 
Like expanding the net through L3Cs, benefit corporations, and profit for social purpose (seeping in at the intersections in a world strewn with shipwrecked souls, from the elites to the street) it rallies all deckhands on board, in working towards integration.

If the banksters Inc, win by exploiting people without pay, (in having social co-ops or social enterprises take over the running of public services etc,) then that's not so good. But when the private sector matches the public sector in generosity, the UK's 'big society' will be an example of general society's biggest bed-in (ever) and that's a thing to celebrate...

...and all in the name of, collectivism.

PM Cameron is right about collective action, 'it's an incredibly simple idea...that's catching on.'

Rod, what do you think about the 'Big Society Bank'?

the UK sector adding to the commonwealth

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:31 AM
Jo

Thanks for your comment
Each reply raises more questions--I dont know if my fingers can hold out
On some of this stuff it may be better to go via email (rod@clearlyso.com) or skype me (rodneyschwartz), which would be even better and my digits can get a rest

Not an expert on L3Cs, but I have heard good things about them
I have not lived in the USA for 23 years!

As for DC's rhetoric, I too like it
It is rather unfortunate it has come alongside massive budget cuts
It makes it seem like a gimmick to paper over the pain, which I do not believe it is
I am pretty sure the Tories are also not sure what it is but that's OK with me
i would rather politicians who raise and then explore interesting ideas to those who pretend to know it all and then implement in a hurry to show they are "action man"--dreary--Blair was that in spades!

As for the BS bank (sorry, I could not resist) I have posted on this in the ClearlySo Social Business Blog (http://www.clearlyso.com/sbblog/?p=852)
I will probably write more and more on this--this is an issue that will run

all the best, rod

the UK sector adding to the commonwealth

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:32 AM
.....and congrats, Jo, on your very witty title!
rod

Public Funding

Posted by Colin Gallison at Jul 21, 2010 11:49 PM
  A very interesting topic Rod. I would suggest that instead of complicating the matter for social investors by providing tax incentives, a better route to take would be to invest in grants for those social entrepreneurs who are hoping to build organizations. Although this results in further paper work and head aches for the entrepreneurs themselves, it appears to me that this might simply be a shovel load on the mountain that already exists when establishing socially sustainable or progressive companies. Investors by nature seek good investments with solid economic and social returns and and have little incentive to invest in something they don't truly believe in simply for a tax break. Lip stick on a pig.

Public Funding

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:36 AM
Dear Colin

Thanks for your very sensible comment

I agree that directing grants at SEs is better than assisting investors
The inbalance now is in favour of having too much cash chasing too few deals

On the other hand grants will only displace and lower returns for existing investors--and make some pigs remain in their sty when they should be sent to slaughter!

best, rod

valuation process

Posted by jo davidson at Jul 24, 2010 01:56 AM

It seems lipstick on a pig is expected at a pigs party - it doesn't change its nature - it's what the pig does the rest of the time that counts, as pigs have more thinking power than pit bulls or sheep. But in exposing double standards (when trying to disguise pork) nobody should be in defense of ham.

What's the third sector been like for you Jeff?
Do you qualify for match funding? I hope the process
isn't like dressing up a donkey (in repackaging established policies.)

You know, in avoiding systemic stress (when building infrastructure etc,) it helps to not stop believing in the sugarplum fairy. When turning societies into genuine communities with a social ethos that transforms social norms, or in instigating change, those who induce fear uncertainty and doubt have something to gain, especially if it's tied in with 'hope and change.'

And in staying afloat, in a rudderless economy, it's team building that creates cohesion (rather than relying on an insider culture) when working toward interdependence.

for a happy ending

Posted by jo davidson at Jul 25, 2010 08:13 PM

I just wanted to add, in changing the culture for societal development, there's another Inc, Integration + New vibration = Celebration...

...and when navigating shifting sands, it pays to be a turtle.

we give money to big oil, why not social entrepreneurs

Posted by Patrick O'Heffernan at Aug 03, 2010 05:23 PM
The US hands out $46 billion in corporate welfare every year, much of it to companies that are destroying the environment and smothering innovation. The US gov hands out "faith-based" grants to religious organizations that lie about not proselytizing in primitive cultures. At very least, there should be a social entrepreneur fund

we give money to big oil, why not social entrepreneurs

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:41 AM
Dear Patrick

Thanks for your comment

I completely share your rage about corporate welfare--it stinks
But there are two ways to "lvel the playing field"
My instinct would be to eliminate the $46 billion

As for the religious organisations, I am keeping mum
I have learned from experience never delve into that area on the internet!!
Call me a chicken

lastly, no, no social entrepreneurs fund with public money
There are already a few in the private sector--here and there
I think there are far better uses for public money in the USA, especially these days

best, rod

Public Money: Yes

Posted by Terry Hallman at Aug 03, 2010 05:57 PM
If governments invest heavily in antisocial enterprise (aSE), of course social enterprise (SE) investment is reasonable fair. Otherwise, SE is doomed.

The main question is "how much?"

99% aSE 1% SE? --> Doom. Don't bother. Same reason you don't get into a poker game with $1 and the other guy has $99. Same reason you don't start a chess game down five pawns, a knight, and a rook or bishop. In both cases, the opposition knows in advance it is dealing with an idiot.

95% aSE 5% SE? Ibid. But the game can last a little longer, for the amusement of the 95% side. ("Lookit, we got us a real, live rube here.") See also P.T. Barnum.

90% aSE 10% SE? Ibid. Might just as well get a uni degree in SE and make lots of money as expert rube.

85% aSE 15% SE? Doable, barely. But, a viable SE can easily be corralled and asset-stripped by the aSE players.

Etc.

50% aSE 50% SE? That's the point of equilibrium and a real contest -- as long as the SEs remain cognizant that the opposition are predators, parasites, and weasels.

Public Money: Yes

Posted by Rod Schwartz at Aug 07, 2010 11:49 AM
Dear terry

Thanks for your very very funny comment

I should say that I do NOT see this as a contest between us SEs and those aSEs
(Like the cute pun, though!!)
Thus there is no equilibrium or balance to be sought
And there is no opposition who are any sort of animal
This is a sort of antagonistic thinking that is one of the reasons we are in the mess we are in

The only sort of balance or equilibrium I would look for is 0/0
There should be no public money for either SEs or aSEs

and as a sector, we should not want to, aspire to or seek to have more govt funding, especially when so many are suffering so across both our countries--lets get this movement to be self-sustaining
As jo davidson says above, that is the only true path to freedom

best, rod

Public Money: Yes

Posted by Terry Hallman at Aug 11, 2010 07:18 PM
Hello Rod,

Humor (humour) aside, US govt. is changing policy along those lines. The idea is to revamp USAID using what sounds like social enterprise(s). Development is to become a primary tool of foreign policy on par with diplomacy and warfare, and is to get public funding accordingly. Aid funding goes up, defense funding goes down. Aid means creating opportunities, not giving handouts. Not to put too fine a point on it, but social enterprise thinking and practice are becoming US foreign policy. It just can't be called social something because social is a bad word in the US, which has been largely an aSE over the past 30 years in particular.

Best,
T.